…Well, you know the rest. 

We’ve been called twins because of our *twin telepathy* but sometimes we couldn’t be more different! In today’s episode, we’re exploring our differences and the assumptions that people make that lead to surprise when they learn more about us. 

Show Notes

The countdown is still on to Jae’s birthday trip! We are monitoring Covid safety requirements carefully to make sure that we and our friends feel comfortable and that we will not contribute to the problem
Update: Yes, we did make it to Disneyland for Jae’s birthday!
“Angela has a problem…” to this day is still the fabricated excuse of choice that my friends, family, or even friends or friends and family use when they want to get out of plans
Today’s episode is all about assumptions people have about us, together and separately, and we wanted to talk about how this shapes us individually, how this has shaped our friendship, and the work we’re doing to dispel false notions of our persons.

Some assumptions are:
Assumption: We’re the same person and agree on everything, have to do everything together, and share all things
In actuality: Jae and Angela are very similar in some respects, but try to respect boundaries with each other and have individual lives and experiences. Example, if you invite Jae to an event, you are not automatically inviting Jae and Angela, and vice versa. We rarely share plans like that, and actually prefer individual invitations
PSA: We recommend friendship audits. Sometimes we have to take a minute and communicate our feelings, and open communication is good for all
Assumption: Both Jae and Angela have been labeled Princess at some point in their lives
In actuality: We can both be particular about things, but there’s more to us than our princess-like quality. Jae likes pink and dresses, but she also like to tinker and figure out how things work. Angela is particular about how she looks when going out for social events, but when she’s casual she’s lounge sets and messy buns all the way.
Assumption: People often ask Angela where her kids are and assume that she’s a teen parent
In Actuality: Angela is sooooo far from a kid person and does not give off kid vibes at all. This first started when she was working in retail and people would ask her if she worked this job because she had dropped out of high school or college to support her kids, or sometime flat out asked her if she was a teen mom. It’s tapered off, but it’s still a question that comes up now and again when making casual conversation in line.
Assumption: People assume Jae isn’t a friendly person
I Actuality: Jae is a super great friend and very caring person. We both acknowledge we can have RBF, but Jae definitely gets these comments more from people, and it opens up the conversations about facial expressions and assumptions in a unique way. Just as we as a society have called for men to stop asking women to smile more, we should be cognizant as women, that labeling another woman with RBF isn’t helping this matter.
Assumption: Jae is going to find The One the first time she goes on a date
In actuality: We’re cancelling this phrase. Let’s stop putting unnecessary pressure on men and women to make relationships that are not a good fit work by placing unrealistic standards on what it means to be a good partner. Angela is definitely guilty of this with Jae and has seen they psychological pressure of this phrase Jae has experienced, so trust us when we say its damaging.
Assumption: Angela as acne because she doesn’t watch her face
In actuality: Yes, washing your face daily is important, but it’s also more than that. Pimples can be remedied with face washing and the proper treatment, but acne as a whole is something that can be caused by a myriad of internal factors as well. Bottom line, unless asked for advice or invited into the conversation in another way, don’t interject your thoughts

Angela 0:00

I pledge myself to the pod loyal I'll always be a p to start a D at the end and an O sitting in between. Welcome back to In Omnia product where we are getting ready to celebrate one of the biggest brightest best events of the year my birth it's your co host Jae

and Angela

Jae 0:25


Angela 0:27

I really like this ongoing Countdown to birthday

I'm just giving people the optimum amount of time to remember without Facebook that

is good. I had a friend Friend of the podcast as you guys know Megan my bag she actually texted me on her birthday this year and I forget which celebrity it was but she texted me like oh OMG I have the same birthday as x person it's today and I was like Oh Happy birthday. She's like yeah, I'm gonna use this now to tell people that it's my birthday without telling them it's my birthday. It was like love that we're doing today. Oh I love that for her she's like no it just really it just it just dawned

Jae 1:04

on me well you know we all can't celebrate our birthday with a national holiday so we have find sly ways to remind people

I still stand by if your birthday falls on any old Tuesday on not a holiday your people are more likely to remember it

Angela 1:19

fair there was that great time in college where you get all like the midnight birthday texts and now my birthday texts roll in between like 630 and 8:30am

oh yeah for sure. It's like when people like first wake up and whatever it is that alerts people now I know Snapchat used to and Facebook but Instagram doesn't do that so how do people remember now they're just good people oh okay well the good people of the world wake up and they apparently have alarm set to remind them to text us in the specifically between 630 and 8:30am you know

Jae 1:48

ideally like we could sparse out a little bit more but like I'm not complaining just like when you wake up to like a bunch of them and then you reply and then like it's like dead for like hours and hours and hours there are silence Yes, but it's okay as we've said we will be in Disneyland for my birthday this year.

Angela 2:04

We leave on Sunday later this week.

Jae 2:08

Oh my god it will be so sad if this doesn't happen. We know leading up to it for three weeks surprise surprise we're entering our own multiverse and recording maybe not the exact week this is going

okay but I feel like we were doing pretty well up until this point we all could have we could have kept it going we

Angela 2:26

could have been My point being like what is it like we don't go I know we're going to Disneyland we're going and meeting

Agatha and spider man and a stormtrooper to Flynn riders

Jae 2:37

reunion already

yes oh wait that actually that brings me into one final question because as I've been packing I've been trying to figure this out do I should I have like cupcakes or something waiting for you when we get there?

No. Okay, yeah, no, I mean I appreciate the gesture but like we get in late and like we're not going to post pictures of like the hotel room because like we're going Disneyland

Angela 3:00

Okay, no, that's fair. I was just thinking about it because I've done a lot of like cupcake cake pie runs for people's birthdays this year. So I was thinking about it and I didn't want you to feel left out

Jae 3:09

I appreciate that. No, I'm good. We can get food in the park or like when we do my birthday up here in Vegas with other people okay, we might do something with that but I appreciate the thought Very nice. Very nice. You said you got a story for us this lovely morning.

I did Yes. And it was actually it was inspired by the cake question because I've been setting reminders for myself to ask you about that but the last time I went to pick up someone's birthday cake and like I brought it over to them and then you know we had it together and like hung out for a little bit but it was really funny because I guess he also had some other plans that night that he had forgotten about and he got a text message saying like hey, like are we still on to me at so and so he's like, Oh wait, he's like I can't anymore. He's like I'm already hanging out with you. That's okay. He's like, I'll just tell them you have like a problem or something and you need to like stay home. That brought me back to college when everyone used to use me as their excuse as a problem. Angela has a problem and that was just the easy way for everyone to get out of going to like anything anything. absolutely anything family event birthday party. I think even someone used it once for a final they weren't prepared for that they still needed like six more pages for their essay so they like email me like my friend has this huge problem. Like I took them to the doctor like completely fabricated but like I was the inspiration for this because I was with them. And so I started thinking about it. I was laughing about it. But then I also realized like how big of a monster it turned into. Because one of our good friends actually at one point when she lived at home for her last year of college, her parents weren't that excited whenever she said she was going to hang out with me because they just knew me as like the girl who always had a problem because they were so used to hearing Angela has a problem. Yep from her and other friends when they wanted to get out of Something so they thought that I had a lot of issues and I was going to be a bad influence on her

you're not a bad influence but you do have a lot of issues

Angela 5:08

okay yes granted I do have a lot of issues health issues familial health issues there are a lot of things that go on around me so it's really not much of a surprise whenever someone says Angela has a problem but also it just rolled into something of its own so half the time that people say Angela has a problem I don't actually have a problem it's just it's believable that I would have a problem

Jae 5:31

Yeah, I think people use it for things you weren't attending

Yeah, I even people who didn't really know me I think one of your roommates in college once said like oh my roommates friend Angela. Bravo

Angela 5:44

Oh yeah, I'm sure she did. That makes total sense. Freshman year or senior year

senior year Yeah, yeah, but yeah, no, I was just thinking about that the other day man good times but also bad times because now I'm just known as to everyone as the girl with the problem you can be known for a lot worse that's true very true. Which leads us right into today's episode topic everyone assumptions that people have about us that aren't necessarily correct or are or maybe they are who knows we might figure out some things about ourselves in this process

for Boomer Angela over here and anyone else who doesn't watch YouTube videos is like a tag a lot of influencers will do on their Instagram will be like what are your assumptions about me we all now know you can fill in those with your own answers because there's no name attached or only the person who sees a name we don't know exactly who's asking these questions allegedly its fans or allegedly if they're trying to get clout they can ask themselves so I trying to be the emotionally intelligent and growth expensive therapy payer I am wanted to take kind of this whole assumption thing a step further and like how some of these assumptions have shaped us helped her evolved from you know, it's birthday season reflection all the good times bad times best of times worse.

Another year older and wiser Good job,

Jae 6:55

Jae. Thank you. So I think that's a good one for us to start off with if I may. Okay, I think I would go with how our first kind of nickname started Oh, okay,

Angela 7:05

this is a good one so when Angela and I started becoming

Jae 7:07

friends we got hauled extensions of each other by one of our sorority sisters and kind of just like decided to feed into it so we just started calling each other extension and so a big thing of that became like oh like two peas in the pod will dancing emoji all that kind of stuff. But looking back on that I think it really I don't want to say like damaged our relationship because I think that's a bit extreme but it's kind of this is like on a very very like diluted scale of like an influencer relationship but it's a thing of like when you're known for being part of a Duo or being part of a group of people and like that's how your place in other people's mind I think that it's hard to balance your actual relationship versus the perception of the relationship.

Angela 7:50

No, I agree because I think that it became complicated for us because we maybe set some unrealistic standards for ourselves in where and how we needed to be there for each other that weren't necessarily put there by us but were put there by other people and then I also think that it was damaging of how we continued to form or keep relationships with other people because some of them looked at it as like oh well whenever we invite one of you to something we're getting the other so in which we

Jae 8:22

never put up like it was never a thing of like I never asked you to go to anything with anyone and vice versa like we never asked it was never like oh I'm going to hang out with I'll and your Oh get my bag it was never a we didn't do that

Angela 8:33

yeah and it also wasn't like when I first joined the sorority like Mike when joining that year I was like if she's not my twin I'll die I was super dramatic about it and telling everyone that but I was never that way with you saying like, oh, if j can't come I don't want to come

Jae 8:47

and also all of our mutual friends we love and adore you and love to see you We also certainly didn't have like the eager beaver to like go hang out with the other people friends All the time.

Angela 8:58

Yeah, we were two people who are very respectful of boundaries in that way because of past friendship relationships that we've had. So we don't like to look at it as like what's yours is mine like your friends are my friends. We're pretty respectful of that. And we like to wait to be invited into each other's world

Jae 9:17

and we do like expect to some extent like I think if Angela never mentioned me or offered for me to hang out with her friends because she since we are all in the same sorority like it'd be a little bit weird, but it wasn't like every time she got a call on a Hangout. I was like can I come? I didn't expect fries if she got fries when she came home but I didn't expect that. But I remember this happened from numerous people on which is where like, I think not where our friendship problems kind of started but where we kind of started to realize things separately, which is where multiple people would say like didn't Angela tell you or didn't Jae tell you this or I don't want to tell you because of her or she's going to tell you and we hadn't gossip made lines about other people. Sure, like all bratty college girls. We have opinions like Oh Did you see what she was wearing? Like we'd have our own opinions but it wasn't like oh so and so got an STD at this house I'm going to go share it with you we were both very non we didn't even bring it up because we knew we shouldn't be speaking about our other friends mutual friends whatever but like we were holding outward with wolf we know one of you knows the other one's gonna know or the big thing for me is I would get a lot of times asked like where's Angela and it's like I don't know you ever phone number caller a lot of things I was a lot more active in the sorority because Angela had some health things going on that she didn't know about so I would go to like a lot of things and anytime any of the people who were closer to Angela came there oh like where's Angela? Like I don't know I came with Dell I came with grace I came with Alli he was like oh like you should coming It's like again or no and it's like I think part of the thing I did was like I tried to be nice if you're Kayla tell Megan I can't come or do something I would try to do it but I think what that did was it set the precedent for them that they could just use the other as a conduit

Angela 10:55

I think over the years especially like since we're not in the same place all the time it's gotten better but we still do run into that from time to time where if say like were both going to the same place and waiting for friends like you might be asked Hey like Do you know where Angela is when it would be just as easy for them to text me versus asking you to text me and I think in a way like I don't know I don't want to say that it like it causes issues between us but sometimes it does because then we feel like one of us is only there because the other one is like oh well if say for example like Brian asked you Hey like is Angela coming today or like where is she and then like you're the only one like texting me about it then it's like I might feel like I'm only going to hang out with you and Brian because you're like actively talking to me about it versus like him like showing an interest in it and so then I feel like I'm just tagging along to your God's plans

Jae 11:47

Yeah, I definitely get that I think the other thing though, which is like we've talked about this which isn't really topic so I'll get back to early quickly something that I'm really like older wiser Jae is kind of coming in terms with a lot of relationships that I think we all kind of need to check in once in a while it's like what version of a person are we interacting with so old Angela like college especially younger college Angela would leave her phone in her dorm but go days without answering her phone her texts wanting to be like a nomad off the grid so a lot of times to get to her they knew they could get to faster I had more attached to my phone I was on social media more I did the thing so people just like kind of got in the habit of that and again we could have we didn't really have boundaries no boundaries right well could have like set that up earlier but I was like oh yeah no like Angela's with me right now and I have my phone so I will just respond back you've gotten a lot better using your phone but I think a lot of people like aren't acknowledging because if you don't stop and really think about it like they still think they're talking to Johnny like 14 Angela who does our phone sorry well of course straights got to get through to her because she can always get thinner it's like yes but I can get through to you maybe like a little bit faster but not so much faster like then anyone else could at this point

Angela 12:52

yeah cuz I mean frankly it's like fortunately just like due to life due to work our podcasting now I can't go days without looking at my phone it needs to be there I need to check it every few hours at least and so it's like yeah granted like Jae's messages are pinned at the top of my phone so like I will see those like automatically even if like I've gotten like many other text messages from people because those are always going to be at the top but I still look at everyone's like it's not as if I'm only looking at yours and then I'm not looking at anyone else's for three days no just to go along with that point as well. I totally forgot it

Jae 13:28

can't help you.

Angela 13:29

Oh man,

Jae 13:30

two separate people here

Angela 13:31

I know Oh, I got it. And just to go along with that point as well I feel like in keeping in mind with like what version of a person you're speaking to I had this conversation recently with another friend who I don't really keep in contact with very often so sometimes I'm not exactly sure how to speak to her because like we can go like months and months without talking I think the last time we even talked before I saw her in person was almost a year like there was almost like a year in between that and so I was actually like talking to her about that. I was like I'm really sorry. Like I know that like I want to reach out to you a lot more and she's like you should you absolutely should. But sometimes I feel like I almost give myself an imposter syndrome because I we are different people and we're not in the same space and we don't really talk a lot it's like but I know it's so easy to talk to you. But sometimes I psych myself out and I feel like that almost might be what our friends do a little bit when they think of us when especially like if we go in between like say like Grace is a mutual friend of ours but like you guys are a lot closer and like you guys talk more often than we do so I think sometimes like I freak myself out when I go to text Grace I'm like oh no, like I only have like three things to say and then what am I gonna say after that? It's just like no, like I can say those three things and it's okay. And then our conversation is gonna flow from there

Jae 14:47

Yeah, I think that's a definitely a thing with like mutual friends. I also just think like in terms of even our friendship because like a few weekends ago, like you slipped over and like we had like a friendship on it. Yeah, and the thing is like that I brought like Not to air our dirty laundry but I think this is the reason I wanted to podcast because I think this is like the important stuff to talk about is like I said like I think we're slipping into some of our old college habits obviously are not healthy college habits or I wouldn't have felt the need to bring up a friendship on it but it was the thing of like even though we've worked I would say very hard on our friendship to keep it and to have it work and to sustain it and to grow it it's hard sometimes just with old habits Old habits die hard Yeah, well there are patterns and there are certain things that get in like I remember my friends from high school love them to death I remember the first few breaks we'd all interacting and I got so petty and I got so like jealous and there were certain competition games I would play in certain things and it's like I tell Angela or Allie or Grayson they'd be like who are you like this isn't like what is happening it's like when you get around people who you were a certain way with sometimes it's just hard and you have to actively like step out of it and remind yourself and remind the other person like hey look at how I've been the past year the past two years or the you know I've been working on this like I know for like this amount of time you knew this but like Please trust and give me space to grow out of

Angela 16:04

I agree and I think well first of all we'll take this time shout out to my lovely little because we always seem to take these friendship audits and her presence yes like I think this is the the third friendship audit we've taken with her passing Yeah. Senior year Paris and now we're staying in Paris I think we we all needed a friendship audit in Paris Okay, I

Jae 16:27

blocked it out Yeah, I got pickpocketed so like that kind

Angela 16:30

of yeah that that took up a lot of time but that that's it that took a lot of space in your in your trip memory so yeah, but we did have a mini one I think I fly like helped facilitate it when we first got there with me and her or me facility me and you you and her and then like a couple days later was all three of us which I think she did that one got it out but yeah, so thank you thank you little for sitting through these.

Jae 16:52

It's good to teach her how feelings work

Angela 16:53

exactly yeah, but I think that it's we were gonna wait to talk about this and like the later podcast too but I think it's one of those things that like we talk all the time we podcast once a week if not once every few weeks, we're constantly talking about podcasting, our job struggles, our job journeys, the everything that we're doing to try to better ourselves, but we haven't really spent a lot of time just being friends lately. Yes, and I think it always reminds me of blackish when dragon Bo had to go to couples counseling and the counselor reminded them it's like your relationship is the Thanksgiving dinner it's like you put the turkey in the oven and you forget about it and you work on the sides she's like but you still have to check on the turkey and we forgot to check on the turkey so now we're trying to be better about that

Jae 17:41

I think the thing that's hard though is this podcast started as like an outlet as a creative thing for us to do and it's like conversation the podcasts are pretty raw and real and what's going on relatively in the moment so it's a thing of like we're getting a lot of the conversations out like how we did an episode on xiangxi the night we watched we would have had that conversation anyway I wouldn't have read that awful money book otherwise for me like I hopefully the next book you assigned me to read can be a quality one but like certain things we would have done anyway we're just doing it granted a little bit more filtered I wouldn't say like significantly filtered I just think the certain things of like like if I knew something would go into a current struggle on let's say like dating Angeles having I'm not going to lead the conversation publicly into something I know she's currently sensitive about and vice versa like it's just not going to lead into something that it could divert off if we were just talking but like it's not that we're not being honest or having full conversations here so I think for a while especially during the pandemic when we couldn't see each other at all this became a creative fun Allah boop because now we've done it for so long I think it has become not a chore to do because like I can be a millionaire just do this for the rest of my life hell yeah. It's not as much of a hobby anymore as it was when we started it because we can now hang out and do other things and because we're busy having otherwise we haven't done it but this is like the one point like we're we're oh well we have to do the podcast so we make time to do it rather than like we have to make time to go get dinner but October we volunteer after when this podcast goes live we will have seen each other at least a once to twice a week.

Angela 19:14

Oh my god. We're gonna do so much and then and then we lucked out November but we have a pretty good amount of stuff that we want to do in December we're just depending upon if things hold

Jae 19:26

out. We're not like rolling out we just don't have anything like particularly playing like October is particularly busy mum into Jan Angela fashion we've rambled on about this first boy versus option for a while. Do you have a personal one you'd like to bring to the table?

Angela 19:38

Well, this this one applies to both of us. Of course it does. Both of us in college were nicknamed princess when we were freshmen. Yep. I feel like we have some things to cop to hear but also at the same time, maybe not. I think it also just has to do with when you get a large group of people together living on their own for the first time. It's like that's when learn about the different ways that people live and the different things that have been taught to them

Jae 20:05

well to segue from that my were all of my male Hall mates who called me princess were yours say oh, okay so how did you get your nickname and then I'll go into how I got my

Angela 20:15

eye okay so first of all I wouldn't go outside without shoes on okay I just that's I don't know like that I think that also just has to do with like my particularly like not liking hand foot Mouth Disease you know? Yeah, so I just I always put some sort of shoe on but then I also i don't know i'm just like it's sturdy. There are things on the ground like I've never particularly been like a person who like sitting on the ground I like to have a blanket ready. I don't like to just sit on my jacket. I like to be prepared for outdoor excursions so that was I think that was my first foray into princess land and then from there they liked to try to find like other things that I was like a little bit more finicky about was this like

Jae 20:53

one occurrence or did it take you currencies for you to like fire the thing?

Angela 20:57

I think it took a few

Jae 20:58

occurrences okay so for me it was a one and done so I mean, I may or may have not mentioned smallpox for I had a gluten allergy until I was eight and back then before it was trendy for Whole Foods before that even exists and all these things. You could not get gluten free bread It was very difficult to so I grew up not eating sandwiches and since I fortunately grew out of it there have been a lot of bread I have consumed I do consume sandwiches just never did it I also don't love condiments so kind of to me is like an eagle pairing of why don't love them I tried my first hamburger this year it was fine not a big burger person. I know burgers exactly sandwich close they're gone. But the point being I don't eat sandwiches. And when my home mates heard that one statement they're like what? I need sandwiches like there was no gluten free bread like I ate sushi and other things like oh like you're a princess so I got it after one interaction in one conversation oh boy so for me this princess one cuts like a lot deeper than that's like one of the occurrences but like I my entire life not like to go off like about me per se but like I've always like had a bit of a chip and a bit of a thing because I like pain. I like girly things I like the things this is that society in the patriarchy have told me my place in society is here's the thing though my family is very diverse of thought very into do what you want be what you want. Like I also really like math. Math was always my favorite subject in school. I'm not like I can't code to save my life. But like I can set up most people's computer people give me their phone or their laptop because they're having a having a minor thing. I can troubleshoot most things. I like technology. I like tinkering. Like my mom always wanted me to be an engineer because I like to tinker what one of the things I did over quarantine our fridge broke four chunks broken again. But like I figured out a video on YouTube on how you can put like a house fan behind it to keep it cooling enough before we could get a repair person in I like to tinker I love these kinds of things. And I kind of succumb to the fact that I couldn't have both sides like I wouldn't be I don't say value but it's like I wouldn't be looking at the same to do both. And it's like I also didn't like sports as a kid. So it's like between liking pink liking girly things like wearing skirts and wearing dresses people pigeonholed me and I let them because the one thing I said I would never do I said I would never ask stupid for a boy but there are so many girls like what is like the weather and like Why is the sky blue? Like I'm like absolutely no I'm absolutely not that bitch it's so ridiculous women standing up for women women should not be stupider than they are to have to get a man period for me because of that I was like well I'm not going to dumb down my intelligence so I guess like oh like damsel in distress it a little bit I'll play into that because I'm not gonna play until like not being as smart as I am and I think like only recently have I been willing to hold both sides equally invaluable and be like yeah, you know what, I don't love playing sports. I don't want to watch him sports but like I can do other things and whether I do them in a pink shoe or a black shoe does not matter

Angela 23:55

no Exactly. I think that I don't know like I was a really big proponent of that as a child I was like I refuse to like pink because I am not going to be put in like you're pretty princess stereotype but I like being a pretty princess so this this is one that I'm in a cop too. I am kind of a princess I like having certain things done for me I like knowing that they can be done for me i like i like putting thought into like my hair and my makeup and things like that but at the same time I also don't like that it becomes something where you get labels like high maintenance because I feel like I'm actually like a pretty like low maintenance person like in a pinch I can do everything myself I'll throw it together no problem I'm I'm never gonna cry because like you won't hold a door open for me. God but like it's it's one of those weird things where it's like you feel like you have to choose one or the other. But you matriarch Yeah, it's like you don't have to it's like both things exist in the same plane. And I feel like there's just there's I don't know, I don't want to say Like that there's not enough that's done to reinforce that, but I feel like dill in terms of the way that like were educating young women like as far as what I've seen, there's it's still being thrown a lot into extremes

Jae 25:12

and it feels very performative all the time. Like I'm a scientist who wears heels I'm a mom and a doctor like it I feel like it's overly emphasized versus like the high maintenance one of the one I've gotten my entire life and it's the one that drives me the most insane because the thing is, I don't feel people use the term correctly I think what like I like luxury things I like expensive things that does not make me a high maintenance person and like when people get to know me frankly even when people get to see me and Angela together everyone will assume I'm higher maintenance than she is spoiler alert. But like the reason is is because like when I leave my dorm room even if I throw on a sorority tank and shorts if I was wearing a sorority tank with a white font I pick white sneakers to go with it in a cute little white bag I will try to elevate what I was wearing a little bit which is more than rolling out of bed and going into class which I just wouldn't do but the thing is no one else but me was impacted by that decision which is why when I got called high maintenance I was the most frustrated because any decision that I made that would people would call me high maintenance about had nothing to do with them like when we would go out I would never tell everyone like I need six hours to get ready so like do this this and this I would know like hey Jae like I'm gonna do my hair before everyone gets here because I don't want to stress there aren't enough outlets for it and I'm gonna do my makeup in my room no one has ever waited for me for me to present myself in the manner in which I would like to present myself and that was always really frustrating because like the decisions I made had nothing to do with impacting anyone else's time schedule I am very respectful and cognizant that like if I do want to do false lashes or I do want to air wrap my hair Dyson please sponsor us I will put the time and I will get up an hour early I will work out early I will do what it needs to do to accomplish what I would like and no one else's expense and to me the whole point of being high maintenance is you have an oblivion to that you don't care the expense and the cost does for other people

Angela 27:09

i agree i think that to me what it means to be high maintenance is that not only are your actions affecting others but it's that you're expecting others to take actions that will help you so for example another friend and I we had this conversation where she went on a date recently and the guy was asking her like oh, like do your nails look cute? like where do you get them done? And she was like oh I don't know someplace in San Jose and they were meeting in San Francisco and he's like you drove all the way to San Jose to get your nails done she was like yeah why and he's like wow, you're really high maintenance and she said like at that moment she was just kind of like I'm done she's like I was finished with my drink I didn't order another she's like and then he was said something like oh you know like you don't have to worry about paying for this like I'll support you and she's next no thank you she like dropped the 10 on the table and walked away She is just like absolutely not she's like I drove myself in my own car with my own money that I paid for the gas and the insurance and everything by myself or my own job to do something that makes me happy she's like I am not she's like I am will never expect anyone to pay for something that I want that is just for me to make me happy

Jae 28:27

oh yes and let's speaking of dates I have some very I don't know if you would say this is pro feminist anti feminist pro woman anti woman stances here I will never go on a date I can't pay my portion of I agree will I let a man pay for me? Absolutely. But I will never go on a date I cannot pay my portion of and that drives me insane. Another thing which I've seen on tik tok is girls are like well he should pay why because my nails cost this much because my hair 10th of the time because my elephants like Chrome I was your decision to do that's all about how you want to feel and how you want to look and how you want to present yourself he has nothing to do with that don't put that on him because you chose to guarantee and if your whole look well the system tells me I have to be ready it's like fight the system welcome well that also was like angele like you've been on we've been on dates with like people we've been on dates with the same person over and over like

Angela 29:14

not not not that we were saying that the same person we've dated individual people set him up

Jae 29:24

correct. And the point being like they don't care I've never had a guy like critique my appearance or anything and I've there are guys out there and it's like the thing is like if that's how you feel and that's what kind of guy you're seeking out. It's a projection thing like just like in college when people would tell us like what we were wearing like oh my god, like frankly like not to throw Angela under the bus or any of my other friends but no one anymore. I Jae you're dressed too nicely. Like I feel underdressed. That is a huge problem like I didn't say like what it's all comes in a frickin ball gown I just might have thrown on like a gold earring tops like the gold hardware on my person. My boots and like a few extra bangles. I'm like a lip gloss. Like that is like nothing like oh Jae you're sober you know how I dress you know how I like to dress and you could wear what you want and it was never a thing of like I've never made a comment about like my friends dressing poorly The only comments I have critiqued as one of my friends appearance like I'm a big thing of like tie your undergarments out like if I see a song If I see a bra strap if I see like a roll that someone doesn't have but it's because of like indentation from like a garment I'll make that comment but it's never like Angela like look who slumming it at brunch

Angela 30:26

I will say you are very good about that because I have had other people who like they have put it nicely but they've been like no leggings today please or like please dress up today and I mean you know frankly I'm a more casual dresser so I appreciate those kind of comments because then like I know I'm like oh I need to step it up a little bit today but there are also people who we've encountered who like or they're not in our social circle but what kind of make comments like that so it's like yeah, that's that's high maintenance I think when you take it upon yourself to then critique how someone else is looking in comparison to you that's I maintenance

Jae 31:03

I think for me high maintenance is like wrapped up or my my level of high maintenance or version is like wrapped up into what I always call it the suitcase analogy if my suitcase if I'm carrying it back to the airport will every time hit the 50 pound Mark exactly 50 pounds I have a skill for a reason at home I can carry and did carry a 50 pound suitcase through Israel for 10 days by myself if I'm bringing a 50 pound suitcase it's because I can carry a 50 pound suitcase not because I'm expecting anyone to help carry it for me Is it nice? Yes And I always appreciate it and I'm gracious when someone offers but I wouldn't do it without being able to do it myself What could be more Why'd you bring that like it's so heavy like did you flex when I was like no I asked if anyone else felt I wanted my curling iron on my extra boots

Angela 31:45

Exactly. And I think it's just about like whatever you want be prepared to carry yourself like I don't care like what your support system look like how like what your circle looks like if your friend only brought a carry on and you have two checked bags you should never expect anyone else to attest to assist yeah it's just and I

Jae 32:07

think also with these like assumptions clearly we took part of it on because like we wouldn't be going on and on about this like if it didn't hit us in some way and I think for both of us It had a thing to do with like when especially when a female is called high maintenance It doesn't just mean like oh you like nice things or oh you have a sense of style or oh you're put together there's a lot it's a loaded word just like for me I used to like to coordinate My Folders notebooks calculators pencils, pencil cases backpacks all that jazz and like in college and in high school like guys would come up to me oh I see you like pink or like is pink your favorite color and it's like whether it was meant to or not I had a chip because of this and it's like it felt like a loaded question I want to do the GO GO Madame idiot because like I have pink like I'm going to score higher than you on the exams I'm a better student than you but like yes I do choose coordinate and have pink things but doesn't mean anything. And like I've been told now it's like are you sure it wasn't their way just to have conversations like yes and no, because sometimes the tone like

Angela 32:57

it's like you start to develop a sense about these things.

Jae 33:01

Yeah, sometimes it's true and sometimes it's not but it's always kind of thing of like you're making a broad sweep of like that may or may not be true. And like if that's your first interaction with me there's a heck of a lot of other things you could say when you don't know me then exactly don't ask my nationality either. And but like there are other ways to say something I feel like that

Angela 33:21

segues right into the next topic is when you can just start to develop a sense about these things. Oh my god, every time someone ever asks me if I have kids, or where my kids are

Jae 33:31

I told you that Angela said she had problems remembering what assumptions about her and I reminded her of this one

Angela 33:38

I did yes yeah, I don't know why like I don't know what it is necessarily about me because I I'm not even that much of a kid person. Yeah, like I will say the one day we went to volunteer with children in college, my heart grew three sizes that day, like the Grinch and it opened up and unfurled to the children and I can I'm a lot better with the non breakable ones but babies and all of that I freak the EFF out I do not really give off kid vibes at all. So whenever someone asks me like, this is strangers. These are strangers usually like on I want to say like on the street that makes it sound on the show. But you know, like in lines in a store at a restaurant or something like that, just like interacting with people and we're speaking and then they asked me like, oh, how many kids do you have? or How old are your kids and then you know when I let them know that I don't have any they usually then follow that up like with another line of conversation so like, oh, like are you in college? What are you doing? Well, if you think I'm in college, but I also had kids to my team parent. Yes. And frankly, just not to get like our two into a racially loaded conversation.

Jae 34:49

Not not very fully loaded.

Angela 34:50

Exactly. It is but it's I don't know it's not one that I particularly enjoy, because I feel like it's far too nuanced for me. To even understand but greed What? Yeah just why are we making assumptions about teen parents and why did we want to ask questions about it? I think one time in a store this was when I was working when I was working in retail like someone actually asked me like how old my kids were and how old I was when I had them just like I don't have kids ma'am Have a nice day. Please leave

Jae 35:22

23andme got pushed back to October 12

Angela 35:24

Oh, that's so mean. Another update for the podcast guys.

Jae 35:29

Angela has sold her DNA to the government Yeah,

Angela 35:31

they're going to clone me Oh, maybe they'll clone me Mr. Smith style and there will just be like 100,000 angels running around one day

Jae 35:39

that's terrifying dawn

Angela 35:40

dawn dawn alright Jae, did you I know you had some trouble too or you didn't think about them before we started recording Have you thought of any assumptions people throw at you

Jae 35:49

instead of a bitch like I just had never had anyone actually say that to me until one of our sorority sisters told us after she joined as a new member my second year Oh the beloved the whatever and on and when you even want to she was like oh my god I thought you were so mean like and the thing is I had never been told this but like my anxiety helps to perpetuate my RBF my resting bitchface and I have resting bitchface in general it's one of the reasons I'm wearing color now more to remind people I'm friendly I am a kind of lovely human being but I have resting bitchface so like make people assume things like very often do I get shy I get like oh you're a bitch or you're aggressive or yeah those are the two and I think like is there merit Yeah, a little bit I can I can be a bitch but like that's not the impression I'm trying to make but I think where the assumption comes in is like a lot of times what people don't realize is like it's a lot of things that I think because we're having more mental health conversations I think it's good it's like I don't have social anxiety but like I do have like anxiety talking to new people and meeting new people how I'm interacting it's like I'm in my head a lot and that can often come off as like a glazed look or like oh you're too good to be here or you don't want to talk to me or things that I work on really hard and I try to make mitigate like it but I think that was like definitely a thing I've had to work through and it's like I think being more open and being able to like hey, like I'm just like really anxious and I'm so sorry like and giving that space is good for people and it's like better because I think part of the reason why RBF and why things are so hard is because you had to fake it till you make

Angela 37:21

it. No and I think that just that opens the light of a conversation that we were having in the cultural appropriation conversations like please give people grace or just like a little bit of grace before you start assigning attributes to them or deciding where like your boundary lines are because when did it stop being okay to give people like 30 minutes to settle in because they might be shy I feel like that's just not something I hear anymore like more and more if you're like oh so like I tried to hold a conversation with them but like they didn't say anything so I just walked away but when you ask like oh like what did you talk about? they asked one question and then walked away.

Jae 37:59

Well, I'm not to go back on like Bama rush tic Tock but like recruitment like so many girls like she seemed an interested it's like, well, like did you ask her something necessarily interesting enough to answer

Angela 38:11

right there clear signals when someone's uninterested like it's not that like their faces glazed over. But like they might like be looking around or like the short answer is when they're not listening to you versus like, have you asked someone a question that they can't answer. Like, if you ask them, Oh, do you like to dance? They're like, Oh, you know, I'm not really much of a dancer. Oh, okay. It's like she didn't make an effort in the conversation. Well, no, it's like if you asked her if she liked to dance, and she said no. But then you proceeded to talk about how you take like six dance classes a week, there's not really much for her to talk about there other than you. And the whole point of recruitment is to get to know potential new members,

Jae 38:47

but like actives would judge pnms off of this and like they don't really seem interested. It's like well, because they weren't asking like how your life is going. For example, sometimes there may be a little bit of matchmaking going on. And like let's say Angela shocked me and all it was Angela from the Bay Area. Oh, so you're from the Bay Area and like that's all I can go off with Angela but if she's a completely different person than I am and has different interests in life goals, probably no she could be like super religious and conservative but like oh, we're from the Bay Area so therefore we can hold a conversation versus like, even if that was true, but she loved Gilmore Girls and we could relate on that we can have a much fuller conversation which is one of the reasons like why I mentioned way back when and our dating episode my dating episode I'm I always try to find what people are passionate about whether I care about it or not. Because when someone is interested in something, the way they speak about in the way they will open up is what connection really, to me truly is about so it's like for example, we'll reference her again Olivia handles a little The only thing Angela told me about her when she picked her up as a little was like Oh, she obscures anatomy. So the first day The first thing I said is like hey like welcome. I heard you a Grey's Anatomy and like Olivia like took some like chocolate shell breaking down to like get to talk to her. But it was a thing of like, it was Something it's a you need an entry point and I think we need to be better at giving people entry points but also knowing where entry points are and putting an equal effort that way as well.

Angela 40:10

I agree and I think that for you if I may I think for you It makes it a little bit complicated is like you really try to look for those entry points but then sometimes if you run into someone who is like you and they're also looking but also on the shyer side, there's y'all are just hitting the wall together.

Jae 40:29

Do you have a human example?

Angela 40:32

Well, the most recent one that I can think of is when I introduce you to set a new person that I'm dating and I like tried to tell both of you like as much as I could about the other so like I hate every point on that list. Yes, I know you did hit every point on that list it's so funny because literally like both of you came at it from the same way of like I'm looking for the other to extend an olive branch to me because I extended every all of brand Yes, yes, you did extend olive branches.

Jae 41:04

I offered this dude ice cream because Angela told me how they love going out for ice cream and I found a place that does a screen flights and he said no

Angela 41:16

okay, in his defense It was like 50 some degrees outside and both of us were freezing hoes don't get caught I know Well at least I know I'm not dating Oh congrats so so there's that I guess wait so actually wait so so he got cold but I didn't really go I was kind of cold does that make me the hoh in this relationship?

Jae 41:36


Angela 41:37

damn oui oui I scream I did eat ice cream very good ice cream we carry on with your assessment but yeah no that's that's just the the the last example I could think of but no like I've seen you encounter people who are also similarly shy and it can it can take a while because both of you are like trying but if you're not necessarily hitting the mark that the other is prepared for it can it can take a little bit we will continue

Jae 42:04

what do people assume about you? Would you one more

Angela 42:07

okay um I have another one if you don't have one yet go for it I

Jae 42:11

think this one kind of goes off slowly and I think it screwed with my dating life I have a bunch of other things as you're my friends perpetually told me and I think they mentioned in like a light way and I don't think they necessarily meant it but it's like the more you hear something the more true it becomes that I would be a one and done relationship person

Angela 42:27

ah yes Angela being

Jae 42:29

included in this glass I

Angela 42:31

have said this many a time and I think pre Jae's dating life

Jae 42:35

Yes. And I think hitting light hearted and I think I like have had numerous struggles dating datathon might not make it look but like you date it there was a lot to build to datathon and for me, it was a thing of like we all want the fairy tale I burned for you bridgerton romance that Shonda Rhimes shows us but like realistically it's not gonna happen and realistically that's not frankly the best relationship or the perfect way forever and ago about being a relationship but being like that I was a bit more naive fairytale oriented and then all my friends are like Jae you're gonna like be married the first person like we just see that for you and although it was mentioned a loving endearing way it's also like a message like the belief and I told myself like oh the first guy you date so the first guy date had a lot of weight on them and then like when it didn't work out, or when it doesn't work out it's like luck like that means I'm just never gonna find anyone and like Yes, I'm not that dramatic. Like I have dated since the first person I dated like we're good we're back on the horse datathon was after that like we're trying but it's a thing of like, I had a lot of pressure for every date I went on because I was like, well it needs to be the one I need to know what's the one it has to be the one I'm I'm someone who's only supposed to have one which isn't fair to me isn't fair to the person I'm dating isn't the most likely Transfer Success and like that was something that was an assumption that like granted i'm not i'm working on the emotional intelligence and the emotional intimacy and like opening up and my attachment style and all that fun stuff. And like I'd say I I'm like I'm doing the work. I'm not like I'd always like I'm ahead of people are in behind people. It's like, I'm actively doing the work to improve these things. So like I'm on that path I'm on that journey. I'm working on it. So it's like I can also like even though I haven't had as much relationship experiences a lot of people because I'm doing a lot of the self work to make myself the best for relationships. I think that also add into it like Jake, you're doing so much work to like, be ready for that partner that by the time you find someone like it'll click

Angela 44:25

and that's not not the case, because then it's like putting you into the position of like, Oh, it's for your work to then fit into this other person not to find the person that fits with you

Jae 44:38

and to fix them based on the work I've been doing which isn't fair to them. psi, don't try to fix people guys. People think they're just there for Well, people will only change when they want and they decide that they want to change no matter how much you try. Do you have an assumption that brought this out on and assess Okay, well,

Angela 44:54

we'll go with this one. Oh, the assumption that I do not wash my face, or take off my makeup you don't take off your makeup. Okay I do take off my makeup now in college yes when we would go out to parties, I would sleep in that makeup because I would not want to take the time to take it off I would take it off the next morning but I very actively always have kept up with washing my face I unfortunately have not been genetically blessed with my skin I have hormonal acne but yeah I have hormonal I don't know what it is I do get hormonal acne I think just like I there's something floating on here probably in the genome that like makes me more predisposed to things like this I found out since Jae turned me on to dr v that just having like people with more melanin in their skin tone are more likely to scar and have things like that occur so you know when I have a very simple breakout even if I don't touch it, I don't pop it I do everything that I'm supposed to do I compress it I use like the little bit of salicylic acid I will still end up with a scar and so it's one of those things that has it wasn't so much of a problem in high school but once I got to college everyone wanted to offer me their advice about what to do with my skin and a lot of it started with just like well what are you doing to wash your face like are you using bar soap? I'm like no like I actually use facial cleansers like I've been to the dermatologist there's a lot of stuff happening here and it's minimizing in a way because like especially like if you if you came to my house right now when you looked at my medicine cabinet like all over my counter they're all of these different things that I have to treat my face for like the various stages that it goes through so when I hear things like well you just need to wash your face better please step out of the conversation

Jae 46:43

to be fair I made those comments only after seeing you would sleep in makeup I didn't just bring it up like oh you don't wash your face it was after actively seeing you didn't wash your face and makeup that I asked like well how often do you wash your face?

Angela 46:57

Yes No you you I mean I will say like out of like the I mean how you didn't even really say it a lot out of like the few times that you set out you probably did it in the most respectful way out of everyone else who's ever brought it up to me

Jae 47:10

also all of the products that you use are because I recommended them to you I told Angela so as soon as I heard this theory which made complete sense but I was even ignorant to at the time that people sometimes you think they have very oily skin actually very dry skin but the boys are not like because their skin is oily is overly producing because there's not enough hydration to it. I told Angela this a year and a half or since the pandemic like two years ago and she did not believe me until someone at Sephora sold her some oil or something and then decided to tell me about this miracle product

Angela 47:40

now I think it was when I went to go get a facial either way but yes yes you told me this a few years ago and then it was only like three months into the pandemic that I started to believe you and then started using everything that you recommended so if you do ever want to look at my entire medicine cabinet it is all sponsored by Jae

Jae 47:58

thank you

Angela 47:59

and does work really well for my skin I

Jae 48:01

might add usually the new tool

Angela 48:02

I just got you know that's very exciting because right now I think I'm using a lot of vitamin C and hyaluronic acid to shrink my pores and it works but it's just lots of sunscreen.

Unknown Speaker 48:11


Jae 48:12

also with many people in our lives multiplying at the moment got to be careful because there's a lot of skincare you can't use while you're really curious like there are a lot of lights you can't like no retinols I know retinol is the big one no Botox no filler I'm pretty sure

Angela 48:27

oh yeah no filler I wonder if you have to get it dissolve I don't know costing we will look that one up. But yeah, those are those are some of the assumptions people have about us that have been weighing on us whether we I mean whether we hear them or not anymore if they still sit with us and they still shaped part of who we were before we all have

Jae 48:46

these and I think the important part necessarily isn't to be they were right or they were wrong or Don't tell me that or you know nothing it's just like think about like I always go back to this quote that I really liked like Dax Shepard were on his podcast he said if someone made fun of me for being short I would have laughed in their face because like he's six feet tall I don't know if he's over six foot and he knows he's tall but he's like if one person question my intelligence like I would freak out I'd be triggered essentially I'd be triggered and I'd flip out so any assumption that kind of like rubbed me the wrong way and gives you a tick probably has like a smidge of truth in there that either you're avoiding you don't want to know or like attaches to a belief you have about yourself which is why I think the ones who brought up like all had some basis of either truth or confirmation of a negative belief we had about ourselves and so I think just acknowledging that that's why these assumptions why what assumptions get you get to you and trying to figure out what you can do to help yourself help those around you. And as one of the missions of the podcast best be a better Kinder person because we can all do that here here

Angela 49:44

and on that note, thank you for listening to this episode of in Omnia paratus Don't forget to rate download and follow on Apple Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. As always where you lead will follow so head on over to @inomniapod Instagram and let us know what you'd like to hear about in the comments. Bye

Jae 50:05


Transcribed by https://otter.ai